Here is some advice for buying new computers: Should you pick an AMD Ryzen 9000 or an Intel Core Ultra 200?
Here is some advice for buying new computers: Should you pick an AMD Ryzen 9000 or an Intel Core Ultra 200?
Hi folks! 1st, the formalities: Approximate Purchase Date: Q3 2025. (Before Win10 official support ends in Q4 2025.) Budget Range: ~€1250 before shipping per 1 PC. Two PCs are to be upgraded, so ~€2500 in total for 2 PCs. System Usage from Most to Least Important: 1st PC : Web browsing (plethora of tabs open), image editing, gaming (casual/moderate, does include simulation games). 2nd PC : Software coding, web browsing (plethora of tabs open), watching movies, gaming (casual, small indie titles). Are you buying a monitor: No. Parts to Upgrade: Both PCs: CPU, MoBo, RAM, CPU cooler (maybe M.2 SSD as well). 1st PC re-used PSU: Seasonic PRIME TX-650 [SSR-650TD] (aka Seasonic PRIME 650 80+ Titanium). Bought Q4 2016. 2nd PC re-used PSU: Seasonic PRIME TX-650 [SSR-650TR] (aka Seasonic PRIME Ultra 650 80+ Titanium). Bought Q4 2020. Current specs of 1st PC: https://fr.pcpartpicker.com/b/bd9J7P Current specs of 2nd PC: https://fr.pcpartpicker.com/b/RRvnTW Other than parts to upgrade, everything else will be reused. Do you need to buy OS: Yes. 2x Win11 Pro (retail) for both PCs. But this is not considered in above hardware budget. Ideally, would go with Win12 when it is released by that time, skipping the poor Win11 altogether. Currently, both PCs are running Win7 OEM licenses, that i upgraded for free to Win10 OEM. Since i have OEM licenses, these can not be transferred over to the new builds. Preferred Website(s) for Parts: #1 https://www.galador.eu/category/187-components alternative: https://arvutitark.ee/en/pc-components/1 Location: Estonia (within EU). Parts Preferences: CPU: Intel or AMD with iGPU. MoBo: MSI. (Either X870E or Z890 chipset.) RAM: Kingston. (Must be the one listed in MoBo memory QVL.) CPU cooler: Noctua, Be Quiet!, Arctic, Thermalright. (Must be air cooler.) M.2 SSD: Samsung. Overclocking: No. SLI or Crossfire: No. Your Monitor Resolution: 1st PC: 1920x1080, 144 Hz. 2nd PC: 1920x1080, 60 Hz. Additional Comments: Both PCs are intended to use ~10 years, or until OS on them becomes obsolete and we can't use the PCs further (like the current situation is). Gaming wise, beefiest game would be Hogwarts: Legacy that we both would like to play. For my PC (PC #1), i can throw in Cyberpunk 2077 as well. The rest of the games are less impactful. And Most Importantly, Why Are You Upgrading: Win10 support ends. Now, both of our PCs are working fine and other than that, there's 0 reason to upgrade. But since 1st PC is Skylake architecture and 2nd PC is Haswell architecture, neither of our PCs support Win11 (or Win12). Possible parts (with current pricing); If Intel build : CPU: €343.80 - Ultra 5 245K: https://www.galador.eu/1903-cpus/18...k-...-boxed-cpu MoBo: €491 - MSI Z890 Carbon Wi-fi: https://www.galador.eu/1904-motherb...-s...carbonwifi RAM: €275.90 - Kingston Fury Beast RGB black 6400 MT/s, 2x 32GB, 2R: https://www.galador.ee/1610-lauaarv...gb...unbuffered Total: €1110.70 per 1 PC. CPU cooler is undecided, but up to 170mm tall air cooler fits into either of the PCs. If AMD build : CPU: €356.20 - R7 9700X: https://www.galador.eu/1903-cpus/18...sa...0001404wof MoBo: €520.40 - MSI X870E Carbon Wi-fi: https://www.galador.eu/1904-motherboards...-amd-x870e RAM: €268.10 - Kingston Fury Beast RGB black 6400 MT/s, 2x 32GB, 2R: https://www.galador.ee/1610-lauaarv...t-...-dimm-cl32 Total: €1144.70 per 1 PC. CPU cooler is undecided, but up to 170mm tall air cooler fits into either of the PC's cases. With formalities over, the core of the matter; While purchase date is about half a year away, i'd like to make my decision regarding what parts to get, well in advance. Hence the topic now, rather than later. For accurate price and availability suggestions, the components must be from the Galador store (or Arvutitark). I'm not going to buy stuff from Amazon, since Galador offers free nationwide shipping with courier delivery and is also a local store (far easier RMA, when needed). We do have a wide selection here, so, i'm certain i can get everything locally. CPU To start off, which CPU to go for. 🤔 Since CPU defines what MoBo and RAM to get. I prefer Intel. Running few right now. Core Ultra 5 would be more than enough. Ultra 7 would be too much/expensive. No "Core i3" in the Ultra lineup as of yet. Even if there would be one, it would fare poorly to stand up for the next ~10 years. So, on Intel side, i'm looking at Core Ultra 5 245K. Sadly, the Core Ultra is a big flop. A bit better than 14th gen Intel, but overall, nothing special. Since Ultra is such a let down, i'm now seriously considering going with AMD. On AMD side, i'm looking at Ryzen 7 9700X, which would be U5 245K counterpart by price. Initially, i did consider R5 9600X as well (€260.99), which is true counterpart of U5 245K, but given that i have budget for U5 245K, R7 9700X would be better counterpart to consider. Pros of U5 245K; * latest Intel gen CPU with LGA1851 socket * CUDIMM * More L2 cache (26MB vs 8MB) * no hyperthreading (better for gaming) * 15C cooler running on gaming loads, compared to R7 9700X, source: https://www.techpowerup.com/review/intel...5k/28.html * lower power draw on gaming loads, compared to R7 9700X, source: https://www.techpowerup.com/review/intel...5k/25.html Pros of R7 9700X: * latest AMD gen GPU with AM5 socket * CUDIMM (MoBo supports it) * more L3 cache (32MB vs 24MB) * lower TDP (65W vs 125W) * hyperthreading (better for applications) * far lower power draw on application loads, compared to U5 245K, source: https://www.techpowerup.com/review/intel...5k/25.html Of course, Ryzen 10000-series (Zen 6) is expected to launch in Q3 2025 and depending how they fare value wise, would be something to consider. But Zen 6 isn't out and i'm currently considering what is available, vs what may become available. MoBo Both of our current PCs are running MSI MoBos, so, new one would be MSI too. I'm happy with MSI and their features + looks. MSI MoBo lineup: https://www.msi.com/Motherboards/Products On Intel side, there are total of 15 choices in Z890 chipset. Some considerable options are: Carbon Wi-Fi and Gaming Plus Wi-Fi. While excluding white PCB/heatsink options since those doesn't fit the aesthetic taste, it leaves 7 options. On AMD side, there are total of 4 choices in X870E chipset. Dismissing white PCB/heatsink ones, i'm left with only option: MPG X870E Carbon Wi-fi. Godlike is way too expensive and Tomahawk is a bit too barebones. RAM I prefer to have 2DPC (2 DIMMs per channel) due to the lower latency. But sadly, due to the poor configuration between CPU and DDR5, having 2DPC means 4800 MT/s max. Anything faster and i'm stuck with 1DPC. 2R RAM (dual sided) is better than 1R RAM (single sided), so, i'm currently considering 6400 MT/s 2R RAM. Now, CUDIMM looks promising and offers better performance, but that when RAM is 6400 MT/s or more. E.g CUDIMM testing: https://www.techpowerup.com/review/intel...5k/27.html If to go with 6400+ MT/s RAM, then i have to get 1R RAM. Still thinking if CUDIMM is worth it or not. 🤔 Not to mention the cost of it. A nice fact is that MSI X870E MoBos are only X870E MoBos (at least as of now), that support CUDIMM as well. Capacity wise, current norm is 16GB. 32GB is advised when RAM usage is above average (or when playing AAA titles). When thinking about future use, i'm currently settled with 64GB since i can't easily add RAM, as i was able with DDR3/DDR4. With DDR5, i have to replace the RAM if more capacity is needed. So, it would be smart to get bigger capacity off the bat, rather than replacing RAM at later date. Oh, Kingston DDR5 RAM height; 34.9mm - Beast 42.23mm - Beast RGB 39.2mm - Renegade 44mm - Renegade RGB CPU cooler This is where i'm the least uncertain of. But that much is known that AIO doesn't happen. There are several solid air cooler options from Noctua (chromax.black), Be Quiet!, Arctic and even Thermalright, making deciding difficult. Since our PC cases support up to 170mm tall CPU coolers, selection is wide. I was thinking mid-sized or even big-boy air cooler, but haven't decided on which yet. Issue with big-boy air coolers (while offering better cooling), is possible conflict with MoBo VRM heatsinks and RAM clearance issue as well. (Did list the RAM height above.) Noctua has good compatibility chart to check clearances. So, with Noctua, i can check compatibility before purchase. Ideally, i'd like to get CPU air cooler which fans doesn't have proprietary mount. Like Be Quiet! Dark Rock Elite or Arctic Freezer 50 has it. Since when fan should die, it would be very hard (if not impossible) to replace the fan. Because then, i have to get the same proprietary fan again. And availability for those in 3, 5, 7 etc years, is questionable. I would not risk it, since i may end up replacing entire CPU cooler when replacement fan is EOL and unavailable. With CPU coolers, i have a wide selection of good ones; Arctic Freezer 36 Black (ARGB) Thermalright Peerless Assassin 120 SE Black (ARGB) Thermalright Phantom Spirit 120 Evo Black Thermaltake Astria 600 ARGB Be Quiet! Dark Rock Pro 5 Noctua NH-D15S chromax.black Noctua NH-D15 chromax.black ARGB is nice to have but not mandatory. M.2 SSD (optional) Having dedicated OS drive off the bat (e.g Samsung 990 Pro 2TB) would make OS installation + personal data transfer easier. Else-ways, i need to clone current OSes to 870 Evo SSDs, format current OS drives (in 1st PC: 970 Evo Plus 2TB, in 2nd PC: 980 1TB), move M.2 drives to new MoBos and install OS there. But this much is sure, that i won't get DRAM-less SSD. For an OS drive, DRAM-less SSD is a bad idea. So, Samsung 990 Evo Plus is out of question. That leaves either Samsung 980 Pro or 990 Pro. At least 2TB (both cost ~€180 per drive). 4TB would be better but 990 Pro 4TB is expensive (~€330 per one drive). Future upgrades, not part of this upgrade (GPU and PSU) Now, i know very well that GTX 1660 Ti and GTX 1060 3G aren't that beefy of a GPUs and would be the weak part in the latest systems. Still, at current moment, both are enough for our needs at 1080p. Moreover, i do plan to upgrade GPUs at later date and go with RTX 50-series, to balance the builds out. Our PSUs are also getting a bit old now. One is 9 years old and another is 5 years old. But since both are Seasonic PRIME units with 12 year warranty and haven't been abused in the years + i'm confident in the Seasonic build quality (after all, i bought the best 650W units money could buy back then), i'm not in a hurry to replace them out yet. I'll probably go with new units when i go with new GPUs. And that's it. Would like TH forums community help regarding the concerns i have with the components i talked about above. -- Thanks in advance, Aeacus
You should probably pick these items because they are good: CPU - Intel Core i9-9700 or Intel Core i9-9800X3D with better cooling. Cooler - Thermalright Assassin Spirit is the best choice for your system. Motherboard - Gigabyte X870 Eagle Wifi is a top seller. Memory - G-Skill 2x16GB running at 6000 MT/s with low latency is great. If you want more RAM, buy two sticks of 32GB instead. Hard Drive - Wester Digital SN850X 2TB is the fastest option available right now. The price comes to $962.60 or a total of $1,191.40. Putting more money into these parts only shows loyalty to brands you don't need. You could spend that extra cash on better hardware like upgrading your CPU instead of just buying the same brand as everyone else.
I think you are doing yourself the most good with these specific pieces of hardware: CPU - Intel Core 9700X (cost 356.20) or Intel Core 9800X3D (cost 585.00). Cooler - Thermalright Assassin Spirit (cost 58.80). Motherboard - Gigabyte X870 Eagle Wifi (cost 255.20). Memory - G.Skill 2 sticks of 16GB running at 6000 MT/s with low latency CL30 (cost 127.10). You can also look at the G.Skill 2 sticks of 32GB running at 6000 MT/s with even lower latency CL32. Storage - a WD SN850X M.2 drive, which holds 2TB of data (cost 165.30). Here is the breakdown: the total comes to either 962.60 or 1,191.40. If you spend more than this on parts, it's mostly just about sticking with your favorite brands for fun or tradition, but there are better ways to use that money. For example, getting a 9800X3D would be smarter than just getting a 9700X.
R7 9800X3D is a super fast CPU but that means higher prices, so I didn't really buy one when I was looking at options. Heck, I never thought about getting top-end CPUs just because we don't use our computers for stuff like 3D rendering or gaming all the time. That actually made me think more about which one to pick. 🤔 But thanks for letting me know that! 👍
Either of those. Not only are they cheap, but they also beat out way more expensive coolers like the Noctua. Thermalrights are quieter than most others and give great cooling while making very little noise. They're a no-brainer here. - Although I might consider putting an AMD Ryzen in that not a bad choice for gaming. You have a plan there, but maybe we should look at getting an RTX4060 or higher later on to last longer. Not really true necessarily. Maybe it helps some games. For the most part though, it's not something worth thinking about. If I want to play long-term, I'd go with AMD. You're probably going to get one more CPU from Intel on this socket. With AMD, you'll have far more options because they start at 6000 and end at 7000 series at the AM5 platform.
Honestly, I prefer going with Ryzen because the Core Ultra version is just too confusing after it came out. Even though Intel said they solved many problems through new BIOS settings and software tweaks, I still haven't found any product that makes me feel confident about switching to them yet.
Yes, Thermalright has some solid choices for cooling your CPU and they perform just as well as brands like Be Quiet! or Noctua, but you can get the same thing for much less money, like half the price of an NH-D15. I also love Arctic coolers a lot. Right now, I'm actually using one of my Arctic coolers on my first build, specifically the Freezer i32. If you need more cooling power later, the Freezer 36 would be a great value pick too. Since there are so many good options out there, it's hard to just pick one single one for sure. 😀 As I wrote at the end of the very first post, I plan on upgrading my graphics cards in the future if needed. When that time comes, I might go with an RTX 5060 or a 5060 Ti while keeping my current 650-watt power supply. Even an RTX 5070 could work depending on how much money I have left over. But if I decide to get the 5070, I will definitely need a new power supply because my old 650W unit won't be enough for that powerful card. With a 250-watt GPU, I'd prefer using an 850W or even a 750W power supply instead of the older ones. Since I don't have hyperthreading in my CPU right now, I can't test it myself personally. But back in 2016, people tested things then, and at that time, having multiple cores didn't help much with gaming. So I'm not sure if anything has changed since then or not. That was true back when Intel had their old processors. They tend to keep using the same socket for a few different generations of chips (like AM4), while Intel used to change things every couple years, jumping from one generation to another. The only time they stayed put longer was with LGA1700 sockets which saw three generations of CPUs in a row. Though, most people don't actually switch their CPU chip for a better one because keeping the same part is cheaper and easier. Especially when you're using an Intel R5 or Core i5 processor already. For example, back when I started my PC (PC #1), I could have easily upgraded to newer Kaby Lake CPUs. But by the time 7th Gen Intel came out with their i7-7700K, the performance improvement was only about 20%, and the price was too high for me at the time. So it wasn't worth upgrading then. That chip from that era was also really hot to use in games back then. Yes. I have seen some problems with Intel's firmware starting around the 13th generation, and I don't think there will be any real fixes even for newer Core Ultra chips. In this area, yes, AMD is much more stable and reliable. It feels sad that Intel has gone down a dead end with their processors but when they perform poorly while costing way more than an AMD counterpart, it makes no sense to buy them anyway (Intel or AMD). Since the release of the Core Ultra 200 series, I haven't recommended any Core Ultra chips to anyone.